Ep. 58: Applying Biblical Ethics Into Dating and Relationships w/ Freddy Orozco

Andrew Marcus:

Hey, this is Andrew Marcus from THE INDOUBT SHOW. Listen, we’ve got a great program today. We’re talking about dating. Now this is a very important topic. We have a lot of young people who are watching who are single or trying to find someone or in a dating relationship, and so we want to make sure we just hit this topic well.

We have Fredy Orozco, who’s a pastor from Northview Church, and we also have Luke Friesen, who’s the youth pastor at the same church. And we’re talking about dating together. I think it’s a great conversation. So, you’ll hear two voices.

We’re just talking about the importance of how to set boundaries, how to look for the right person, how to date in a godly way, what does the Bible give as a resource to us to make sure that we are dating well, as well as parenting well when it comes to helping our kids in the dating world. And so, it’s a fantastic conversation, an important conversation, and we hope you enjoy the program. All right. We have Fredy Orozco in the studio today. Fredy, how are you doing?

Fredy Orosco:

I’m doing great. Thank you.

Andrew Marcus:

I feel bad because we did the little quick introduction, but tell us a little bit about who you are, what you’re doing. You said you’re from Oregon, so you’re an American.

Fredy Orosco:

Yes, yes. I am. I am.

Andrew Marcus:

Come on.

Fredy Orosco:

So, I’m an American guy, so I’ve known Luke for a hot minute. I came up to Canada for a mission trip.

Luke Friesen:

You called nine years a hot minute.

Fredy Orosco:

A long amount of time.

Luke Friesen:

That’s actually quite offensive. We’ll be right back after.

Fredy Orosco:

All right. This was my last time being here, or maybe this is Luke’s last time being here if I’m here. Luke will only come if I’m not here.

Andrew Marcus:

That makes sense.

Fredy Orosco:

Anyways. I came up to Canada for a mission trip and then met a girl.

Luke Friesen:

Because we need it.

Fredy Orosco:

Y’all need Jesus. Y’all need Jesus.

Andrew Marcus:

That’s so important that people come to Canada and help us.

Fredy Orosco:

Everyone says I was for the Bible belt, but I’m like, I’m still not seeing it, I’m not seeing it. Oh, you got a lot of churches. We got more Starbucks. So then I’m like, “I’m just trying to reach the people.”

Andrew Marcus:

I’m on mission.

Fredy Orosco:

That’s what I’m saying.

Andrew Marcus:

Mission-

Fredy Orosco:

So, met a girl on the trip because I was interested in the girl, started going to Columbia Bible and then pursued vocational ministry. So then, I’ve been in Canada since 2013. I’ve been at Northview that entire time. First as an attendee, then as a volunteer, and then on staff since I guess 2016. I spent a year on staff as an intern. Left for a year to finish my undergrad and then came back in 2018 that summer. And then have been there in different roles, four different roles since I guess.

Andrew Marcus:

And you’re currently the young adults pastor?

Fredy Orosco:

Currently, yes. Currently, young adults pastor.

Andrew Marcus:

Cool.

Fredy Orosco:

And I started that two summers ago, summer 2022.

Andrew Marcus:

Cool, cool. Awesome.

Fredy Orosco:

Or 2023.

Andrew Marcus:

Awesome.

Fredy Orosco:

2022. I don’t know. It was a while. It’s been great.

Andrew Marcus:

It’s been a hot minute.

Fredy Orosco:

Yeah. It’s been a hot minute. A hot minute is an indefinite but good amount of time.

Andrew Marcus:

Okay. So, when it comes to dating, what advice would you give young people who aren’t dating yet to help them discern that process and picking the right person?

Fredy Orosco:

That’s a great question. So, the very first thing I think that has to happen is a Christian young person needs to be self-aware. You do have to know who you are as a person, as a Christian. And so, I preached on this whatever a month ago, use Proverbs 4:23 that guard your heart with all wisdom from it flow the springs of life from it. The person that you are dramatically shapes the direction that you end up going in life.

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah. That’s good.

Fredy Orosco:

So, I was like, if you’re a Christian kid that is Christianity to me means I go to church on Sunday. I’m trying to find someone that’s a 10 out of 10, a smoke show. I’m like, you might. But if that’s your criteria like lukewarm Christian or a cultural Christian that is physically attractive, I’m like, “You didn’t say anything about character, you didn’t say anything about values.” I’m like, “You don’t know yourself at all. You’re not thinking with your heart, you’re thinking with your passions.”

So, my first counsel is I don’t even know if you’re ready to date. The very first question is, is now the right time for you? And people are like, “Yeah, I’m lonely.” I’m like, “Well, no.” Lonely just means that you want to date. That doesn’t mean you should be dating. If you should be dating, there are some things that have to be in place. You need to know who you are.

And I’m like, “That comes with some time, that comes with friendship, that comes with maturity.” But I’m like for a lot of kids, that’s why so many people mess it up when they are dating. They don’t know who they are. They find someone that they find attractive and then they’re like, they mix. They just become exactly like the other person. Or they play the game and they become what the other person wants. But they have no actual personality. They have no values.

And I’m like, that ultimately is an unfulfilling thing because you’re chasing an experience that isn’t that great. Romantic love is a fun experience, but it’s a terrible God. Ultimately, it’s not an enduring fulfilling thing.

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah. That’s a good word, because the question right away is, “Okay, so how do I find someone?” It’s like, “Well, stop looking outward first.” It’s like the first place to actually look is inward. And if that’s the case, then do you say you should be at least a certain age because that’s hard to do and hard to look in when you’re 12 years old or 30.

Fredy Orosco:

Yeah, 100%.

Andrew Marcus:

As a young person-

Fredy Orosco:

That is a phenomenal question. It becomes pretty subjective. So, my principle is one degree removed from Proverbs 4:23, that you need to know yourself. You need to know your heart. But then the question, well, at what age do you know your heart? I’m like, “It seems to be very subjective.” Depends on the kid. So then, I don’t know, the counsel I give kids now is I’m like, probably high school is a good time, but I also know Christian people they’re not in high school.

Andrew Marcus:

And just wait until they’re in college or whatever.

Fredy Orosco:

When I was a kid, I was told I couldn’t date until I was 16 and I dodged some troubles in middle school because I wasn’t allowed to date. I also listened to my parents like, I didn’t have to. So, I was a compliant kid in that way. But then looking back, I’m like, I dated at 16 and also made dumb decisions.

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah. For sure.

Fredy Orosco:

So, I was like probably would’ve been better if I waited until I was 18. But then I dated when I was 19 and made dumb decisions. So, I’m like, “You know what? I don’t think it’s about the age at all.” There is a kind of heart posture that needs to be in place. And the reality is the kid who has the burn to date is probably the least equipped to recognize that they’re mature enough to date.

So, the person who’s most equipped to do that would be a parent and if not a parent, so let’s say the reality of life in a fallen world, split parent household, blended family situation, not everyone has the ability where a mom or dad would know them well enough to say, “We see this growth in you. We know that there’s enough maturity in you that you know what you’re looking for, you know who you are.” Then I’m like, “Well then, a good group of godly friends or a pastor would fill that gap.”

But it does somewhat I think need to come externally because I’m just looking back on my experience, and this is I guess empirical data, I don’t know if I was ever ready to “date” in the sense that I knew exactly who I was and what I was looking for. That didn’t happen until I was 22 and met Rebecca, my wife. And in the moment, I didn’t realize that I knew what I was looking for. I was just like, “She’s a pretty girl. I think I’m attracted.” And then we got married and I’m like, “Oh, yeah, this is why I wanted to marry her. She met all my criteria.” And it’s come full circle. It’s been a beautiful thing.

As I teach now on dating, I look back and I’m like in pure ignorance and through the providence of God, I have lived the right things through no effort of my own. I didn’t go into my relationship with Rebecca thinking to myself, “I know exactly what I’m looking for.” I didn’t pursue her thinking this is a woman who’s very compatible and will build a good life with me because we want the same things, but it just happened to work out. So, I’m thankful God blessed me. I was not very smart.

Andrew Marcus:

And I feel the same way, too. I feel like, and Michelle, my wife, we talk about this all the time, too. We just had her 10-year anniversary this year.

Fredy Orosco:

Praise God. I love that.

Andrew Marcus:

So amazing. And she was just saying there’s just like, “I couldn’t have even picked you if I tried.” In God’s providence, there’s also this part of it that God just knows and helps us for sure. How long did you date before you got engaged?

Fredy Orosco:

Eight months, nine months.

Andrew Marcus:

Eight months, nine months. And what about you?

Luke Friesen:

We dated a year and a half.

Andrew Marcus:

Okay. Yeah, I think we dated I’d say like two years.

Fredy Orosco:

So, to be fair, we dated eight months, but we lived together for six months before we dated.

Andrew Marcus:

Can you just explain what you mean by lived together?

Fredy Orosco:

That’s my Christian punchline.

Andrew Marcus:

We’ll be right back after these messages from Sam.

Fredy Orosco:

This guy is a pastor, are you sure? Yeah.

Andrew Marcus:

He’s in ministry, right?

Fredy Orosco:

Yeah, yeah.

Luke Friesen:

Maybe not anymore.

Fredy Orosco:

This was the moment.

Luke Friesen:

I think he’s done.

Fredy Orosco:

This was the moment I lost my job.

Andrew Marcus:

I think he’s done.

Fredy Orosco:

So, I met her on a mission trip. So, we served together. So, she lived in the girls dorm. I lived in the guys dorm.

Andrew Marcus:

That’s funny.

Fredy Orosco:

So then, I remember I had every single meal with her for six months. We sat at the same family style seating. We went to Thailand for the outreach phase. So, we were in the middle of the jungle, her, me, and six other people. So, I just spent a lot of time with her. So, after the trip ended, we weren’t allowed to have romantic relationships during the trip.

Luke Friesen:

So, you didn’t date during the trip?

Fredy Orosco:

No. We were interested. We were interested, Luke.

Andrew Marcus:

It was clear, I’m sure.

Fredy Orosco:

So then, when the trip ended, we graduated, whatever, it was a Friday afternoon. Friday night, we went out for dinner. That was our first date. And then the end of the night Friday, I was like, “Will you be my girlfriend?” So, it was like we moved fast, but we moved fast because we both knew what we wanted. And then started dating that summer I moved to Canada. So, it was like we only dated eight months. We were engaged six months. But I knew a lot about her and I’d met her family through the mission trip thing. So, it was an abnormal dating experience.

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah, yeah for sure.

Fredy Orosco:

So, I’m like what Luke described I think is a lot more normative for people. It’s a girl he knew. So, Luke, tell us a little bit about your queen, how you met her, all that.

Luke Friesen:

Yeah. So, we worked together at Northview. She was the daughter of an elder. I was the son of a pastor.

Fredy Orosco:

Come on.

Andrew Marcus:

Nice. That sounds like a perfect match.

Luke Friesen:

It was good. And I got to observe her. She was one of my youth leaders at one point before. And so, that was really good and helpful.

Fredy Orosco:

Hold on. And her sister.

Luke Friesen:

Oh, her sister was my admin assistant.

Fredy Orosco:

There you go.

Luke Friesen:

So, that actually was harder. But anyways.

Fredy Orosco:

Shout out.

Luke Friesen:

Shout out to Annaleigh.

Fredy Orosco:

It worked out though. It worked. She had a sister by the end, right?

Luke Friesen:

Her sister or Danae, my wife, her sister married my brother.

Andrew Marcus:

Oh, yeah. That’s right. I think you told us that when you were here. I can’t remember.

Luke Friesen:

I don’t remember this little itsy bit. I think the insiders got that one.

Andrew Marcus:

Insiders got some, they got a little bit of dirt on me.

Fredy Orosco:

You’re looking at Northview royalty.

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah, that’s what he said. Northview royalty, for sure.

Fredy Orosco:

A powerful alliance between house freezing and hostiles. Yes, sir.

Andrew Marcus:

Hallelujah. And then, so it was a year and a half before you got engaged?

Luke Friesen:

Yeah. And then we got married in six, seven months after we got engaged.

Fredy Orosco:

And there were a lot of finger guns at that wedding, so many.

Andrew Marcus:

Oh, come on. I can almost hear them. There probably was tons.

Fredy Orosco:

So good.

Luke Friesen:

I came down the aisle like that. I came down like this.

Fredy Orosco:

It was like a remix of Gangnam Style.

Andrew Marcus:

That’s so funny. I’ve heard wisdom from pastors saying it’s a healthy time period to date for a year so you can see that person in all seasons. You know what I mean? So, you missed winter. You missed winter or you missed a season.

Fredy Orosco:

No. I met her January 6th, 2013. I got engaged January 25th, 2014. We got married August 2nd, 2014. So, I’d known her for over a year. So, I did see every season.

Andrew Marcus:

So, you did see that?

Fredy Orosco:

Yeah, yeah.

Andrew Marcus:

Because that is helpful.

Fredy Orosco:

So, we didn’t date in every season, but we were together. So, there is wisdom to that.

Luke Friesen:

Given a numerical timeline though can be deceiving of like, “Oh, Fredy’s ready to date at 16.” Sixteen roll along and you’re like, you’re not ready to date.

Fredy Orosco:

100%.

Luke Friesen:

But like you said, I was ready at 16. It’s like we dated for a year, you should know that we should get married. I guess, we’re breaking up. It’s been a year. It’s like, well, that’s not how it works. You’re making a lifelong commitment. So, it’s like sometimes metrics by numerical don’t actually help.

And so, sometimes you have to think of another way to figure out, is this actually good? Am I the right time? I think in my head goes to Prince Caspian when Aslan’s like to Prince Caspian, “Are you ready to be king?” And he’s like, “No, I’m not ready to be king.” And Aslan’s like, “Nice, now you’re ready to be king.”

Andrew Marcus:

Perfect.

Luke Friesen:

“The fact that you don’t know you’re ready, you haven’t arrived.” Because none of us have arrived because all of us in our dating experiences probably were not great, but us acknowledging that we weren’t ready is actually probably acknowledging we’re mature enough to understand we suck.

Andrew Marcus:

Same with having kids. It’s like, are you ever actually ready? It’s like, not really, but we’re ready to…

Luke Friesen:

Totally.

Fredy Orosco:

That you can position yourself well.

Luke Friesen:

Yeah.

Andrew Marcus:

Sure.

Fredy Orosco:

Because I was a hooper or a benchwarmer. Come on.

Andrew Marcus:

You’re pretty good at ball though.

Fredy Orosco:

I’m might. I’m nice inside. I got to tough layup package. I think of the four quarters of a basketball game as the stages of a relationship or seasons, we can mix the metaphors together, where I’m like, just because you’re in each distinct season doesn’t mean, or each quarter they numerically the same amount of time. It’s eight minutes or 10 minutes, 12 minutes, but it doesn’t always progress at the same rate.

So, you’re getting blown out by 30. Your coach hopefully has used a few timeouts in the first quarter and slowed things down where, “Hey, we’re going to get crushed in this game. We want to keep it competitive.” Or you’re rotating lines or TV timeouts. It doesn’t always play out at the same pace as you move from each stage.

And so, the language that I use with young adults often is that you’re moving from stages where there are at least three stages. So, I can try to find a fourth one arbitrarily, but there’s at least three stages of friendship where it’s a one-on-one relationship, and then it moves into a peer group where you meet the family, you meet the friends. Where now it’s not just you. You’re not an item or you’re not just an item. Now, the acceptance isn’t just from you, now it’s from your community.

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah, which is huge.

Fredy Orosco:

Yeah, 100%. And it’s really hard to move forward if you don’t have acceptance from that community. And then the third one is like, okay, are all the red flags that would prevent a marriage, are those dealt with? So then you have, I know several young adults that, “I’ve been in that third quarter for a while,” but I’m like, “well, we love each other’s family, things are great,” but I’m like, “there are personality differences that are creating a lot of conflict today.” Or “We have vocational goals that aren’t quite congruent.”

So, I’m like, “One of you wants to work in real estate in the Fraser Valley and one of you wants to be a homesteader in Alberta.” I’m like, “Well, you can’t do both. You can’t have two homes. You got to pick a spot.”

So, you might be in the third quarter for a long time. That’s okay. At any point, you can lose the game. You can break up and move on. And if you have boundaries that protect you spiritually, emotionally, physically, I’m like, there’s no regret. Or Lord willing, there would be no regret. But I’m like, “The point of playing the game is,” I’m like, “well, can I win at life with this person?”

And that’s what I tell people. I teach the pre-marriage class sometimes, and I’m like, “You have ideally 75 years with this person, could you come home to this person the way that they are if they never change again?” Which I’m like, “Hopefully they do.” Sanctification is an ongoing process.

Andrew Marcus:

Yes, for sure.

Fredy Orosco:

But I’m like, I have been a non-punctual person since the moment Rebecca met me and she has hated it in me since the moment that she met me. But she was like, “I’m willing to overlook that because he checks my other boxes. He checks the things that really matter. Do I want a punctual husband? Undoubtedly.” But she’s like, “More than that, I want a husband who helps with kids,” which I have been. That’s because I really wanted kids and she grew up Dutch family. The husband’s dads don’t do anything to help with the family because I work.

She’s like, “Yeah, my husband needs to work too, but can you get up and help with a baby in the middle of the night?” I’m like, “If you need, yeah, sure, I can do that.” She’s like, oh-

Luke Friesen:

I might be late, but you know.

Fredy Orosco:

Which does happen.

Luke Friesen:

We’ll let them cry for an hour and just make sure-

Fredy Orosco:

We cry it out, man, come on.

Luke Friesen:

Yeah, that’s not punctual.

Fredy Orosco:

I’m teaching that baby self-discipline. You already know, self-soothing. “Life only gets harder, babe. Oh, you’re mad because you’re a little bit hungry. Dude, let me tell you about fighting the flesh. I hunger and thirst for righteousness. You feel me? You’re happy with milk.” So, I’ll be preaching that baby.

Andrew Marcus:

I’m teaching them.

Fredy Orosco:

Come on.

Andrew Marcus:

It’s so funny. Okay. So, you admitted growing up, dating had some bad experiences. I’ve had that. I’m sure we’ve all had experiences with dating. How would you help a young person who has had pretty traumatic experiences overcome those to date again?

Fredy Orosco:

Yes, yes. I think probably I would go to just a passage of scripture. And anytime you’re giving biblical counsel, you want to give biblical counsel, start with God’s word. So, a passage like 2 Corinthians 5:17. If anyone was in Christ, he’s a new creation. Behold the old has passed and he has come.

So, I’m like, one of the beautiful things about the Christian faith is that built into it is second chances. The idea that I’m too far gone or I’ve messed it up or this can’t be redeemed, is a non-Christian idea. If you are a Christian, then built into your faith system is the understanding that, A, I will fail, I will sin, I will mess up. And B, when I do, repentance is always available. And then C, as I live out that repentance, God will give me another chance.

And I mean, not every other chance is exactly the same. You live through a very painful divorce, for example. There will be some scars. It’ll be harder to remarry, but you probably can. There’s a pathway forward because Christian life is built on second chances.

So, a young adult kid who’s like, “I picked the wrong person, crossed a lot of physical boundaries, compromised my integrity in many different ways, did a lot of things I didn’t want to do, ended up in situations I don’t want to be in,” I’m like, “I don’t think I’m ready for this kind of thing.” And I’m like, “Well, maybe.” But I’m like, “But do you know who you are?” “I’m a Christian. I want to live for Christ.”

Okay. I’m like, “Do you know what you’re looking for?” “Yeah, I need a person who’s committed Christian. And by that, I mean actually serves, actually reads their Bible, actually prays. I want someone that really values friendship. My last relationship, we spent every single moment together and I realize now that’s unhealthy and I want someone that wants a community around them.”

So, I’m like, “Okay, so Christian, the community focus. Okay. Anything else that’s super important to you?” And they’re like, “Probably someone fun. I don’t want someone who is boring or super routine based.” I’m like, “That sounds great. You messed it up. Everyone messes up.” I’m like, “But you just told me you’re walking with the Lord today and you just listed three things that you are looking for in a person.” I’m like, “You’re ready. You can jump back in as long as that person matches those three things. And if you realize they didn’t actually match those three things, back out, break up. You jump in, go for it.”

Andrew Marcus:

Okay. So, another big thing I want to talk about, and I didn’t prep us for this, but I want to bring it up. We’re in the age where a lot of stuff’s online and a lot of people are dating online and trying to find someone online. What would you give wisdom to people who are trying to find someone via the interwebs?

Fredy Orosco:

I want to hear Luke’s wisdom first. Finger guns.

Luke Friesen:

So, I don’t think it’s a bad place. I have friends who have gone on dating websites-

Andrew Marcus:

For sure. Yeah.

Luke Friesen:

… or whatever and found-

Andrew Marcus:

Absolutely. It’s like the new normal.

Luke Friesen:

It’s just anything else, be smart, have wisdom in who you decide to go out with, but it’s going out on a date, it’s like figuring it out. So, it’s like if it takes a couple people online and be like, “Actually after one date, I don’t want to go out with them again.” Just be clear and honest.

But online is a fine place. I think there’s some things that are better or some websites or apps are better than others. I’ve heard really good things about Bumble. That’s where the girl initiates always. So then it’s not just creepy pickup lines on Tinder or whatever it is.

Fredy Orosco:

The DMs, the dreaded DMs.

Luke Friesen:

So, I think it’d just be wise with what you have. I remember when I was single, I put on a Tinder profile and I’m like, “Oh, I love Jesus” on my profile. First question, a girl put, “We both matched,” and she’s like, “why do you love Jesus?” And I don’t even know how to swipe. And then I’m like, didn’t even respond. I’m like, “I don’t need this then.” And so, she was criticizing Jesus. And I’m like, then this isn’t for me.

Andrew Marcus:

So, it’s basically the same thing as dating in person or meet someone at church. It’s just be wise, have that criteria, know yourself and know what you’re looking for basically.

Fredy Orosco:

And I think that in the experience, I think I absolutely agree. It’s basically the same thing. In you creating a profile, writing in the data, I think it’s interesting to see what people put on there where I’m like, it is very easy to be dishonest in what you’re posting. “This is the best version of me.” I’m like, “Well, is that what you’re actually about?” “I’m really outdoorsy.” I’m like, “Well, you went on two hikes and you have a Patagonian jacket.”

Luke Friesen:

It’s a good hike though.

Fredy Orosco:

Yeah. “It doesn’t make you outdoorsy. What pictures are you posting? And you are presenting a profile. You want to attract attention.” So, I’m like both guys and girls will do the gym photo or the swimsuit photo. I’m like, “You totally can.” But then I’m like, “Whatever you’re posting, you’re saying this is an accurate representation of me.” I’m like, “If you’re a professional surfer,” I’m like, “that probably makes sense. If you’re not-“

Andrew Marcus:

You surfed once or paddleboard once.

Fredy Orosco:

Yeah. So, my point is, I had a conversation with a young woman who was putting together a profile and she’s like, “I’m not getting a lot of hits. What are you thinking?” And she looked crazy intense. And I’m like, “I don’t think you’re like that in real life.” Where she had a picture of her wake surfing. She had a picture of her graduating with I think a master’s. It was a very high achieving young woman. And she was like, “Yeah, I’m just not getting a lot of … ” I’m like, “Who are you looking for?” She said, “I just want a guy who loves Jesus.” So, “You’re not looking for a PhD?”

Luke Friesen:

Yeah, PhD, professional surfer.

Fredy Orosco:

Yeah. And she was like, “No, I’d be happy.” I’m like, “Well,” I’m like, “the way you’re presenting yourself, the impression I’m getting is you want someone at the same level of academic success or greater, like a blue collar guy who frames and graduate high school barely,” I’m like, “that guy’s seeing this and he’s not thinking to himself, ‘That woman would be super interested in me.'”

So, I’m like, “Whatever you’re presenting, that is what you’ll be attracting.” So, I’m like, “Yes, use it, but also be wise in what you put on there in the people you’re attracting.”

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah. That’s good. Okay. So, we talked about, you mentioned your parents said, “Okay, when you’re 16, you can date.” How would you coach young people to just honor parents? Because some parents will say different things.

Fredy Orosco:

That’s tough.

Andrew Marcus:

If the kid, the young adult feels like they’re ready but the parents are saying this or whatever the case is, what’s the best wisdom you’d give to a young person who maybe doesn’t agree with what their parents’ boundaries are for them?

Fredy Orosco:

That’s a tough one. So, Fifth Commandment, honor thy mother and thy father. Honor your parents. Where that is one of the most challenging dynamics in my ministry context, honestly. I interact with young people and they’ll give me advice that I’m like, I strongly disagree with that. So, what’s your motivation for this? What’s what my mom and dad taught me? And then it puts me in this awkward situation where I’m like, “I don’t agree. I think their advice is bad.”

So, “No relationships in high school ever.” I’m like, “That’s such a hard and fast rule.” I’m like, “Is that true?” I’m like, “That’s not my conviction.” But there are parents. I know kids who’ve told me. “Yeah, my mom and dad told me I can’t date in high school because it’s a waste of time. There’s nothing to be gained.”

Luke Friesen:

Chris met his girlfriend in high school and his wife now.

Fredy Orosco:

My wife. Yeah.

Luke Friesen:

See?

Fredy Orosco:

So, I’m just like, “Is it wise to avoid a lot of high school drama?” I’m like, “Absolutely.” But I’m like, “If you are a mature 17, 16-year-old kid and you find someone that you enjoy being around,” I’m like, “man, eventually you have to learn self-control.” So, I’m like, “Why not start at 16? It doesn’t start when you get married.”

Luke Friesen:

Well, even in, if parents are watching this and they’re gave this rule to their kids, I’m like, where’s a better place for them to learn how to date under your watch and care and being with you or at a university far away from home where their best friend, Chad, is telling them how to pick up chicks.

Let’s actually have some wisdom in here. This is a discipleship process that we get to have as parents is to walk with your kid while they’re dating. And then the truth of the matter is, you’re going to tell your kid you can’t date. Now, there’s going to be this weird thing where this guy and this girl, they’re going to not date. Everyone knows they’re dating, they’re just not allowed. So then, what have you shown them?

Andrew Marcus:

What’s the point? Yeah.

Luke Friesen:

What’s the point of this? You’re saying don’t like anyone? Okay. Tell a high school boy he’s not allowed to have any crushes on anybody. And if someone likes him, he has to walk the other way. So, I’m like, it’s just not practical of setting these number rules.

Andrew Marcus:

So, it’s important for parents to raise their kids, teach them and train them, equip them so that they know the expectation. And then what are the chances of the parent when the kid, like you said, goes to university, they’re not going to have that much influence anymore to help them train them.

Fredy Orosco:

And I think to be charitable to the parents that I’ve given this advice, it is well-meaning in that they are trying to avoid-

Luke Friesen:

They’re trying to protect. Yeah.

Fredy Orosco:

… problems. But Luke is absolutely right. It’s a discipleship moment and I’m like, there is no avoiding discipleship.

Andrew Marcus:

This is a very important topic. We want to make sure you’re set up for success. I just think there’s so much great resources here, so we hope you’re blessed and encouraged. All right. Well, Fredy, thank you so much for joining us on today’s program.

Fredy Orosco:

Complacer, papi.

Andrew Marcus:

Translation, “Thanks for having me.”

Fredy Orosco:

No, “It was a pleasure.”

Andrew Marcus:

Okay. Yeah. Hey, thanks so much for joining us today. For more great content, check out THE INDOUBT SHOW on YouTube, Spotify, Apple Music, or wherever you stream your podcast. We hope you enjoyed it today. Feel free to check out indoubt.ca. We have some great resources available to you. Have an awesome day.

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