Ep. 81: Out Of CONTEXT Bible Verses w/ Dr. John Neufeld

Andrew Marcus:

Hey, INDOUBT Audio World, Andrew here. Welcome to the INDOUBT Show. We’ve got a great program. Today, we have Dr. John Neufeld, my favorite Bible teacher, and today we’re talking about context. A lot of believers take passages of Scripture, they cherry-pick them out and use them for their own purposes, and that can be very dangerous in how we know about God, how we study God, how we understand God. And so we’re going to talk through some of the most commonly misused passages of Scripture and just talk about the dangers, the risks of when that happens and how we could avoid it. So I think it’s going to be a great conversation, an important one, because we need to be in our words and we need to understand what we’re reading and how to apply it to our lives, and so we hope you enjoy the program. God bless you guys. Well, today in studio we have Dr. John, Neufeld. Dr. John, how are you doing today?

Dr. John Neufeld:

I’m doing great, thank you.

Andrew Marcus:

We have a great conversation today, and I feel like a lot of times people take passages out of context and then they quote it and then they quote it and they keep using it, and then it becomes misused and then it shapes their theology and they start to think certain ways about God, about His character or how He works. Tell us the dangers of people who do that.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Well, sometimes you kind of think about the Scripture as just a series of sticky notes, and because you do that, you have no idea of what the Bible is actually communicating as you take a line here, a line there. I mean, sometimes that results from the fact that people have never heard, let’s say, an expositional sermon where you actually follow through the text and allow the text to tell you what it wants to tell you, rather than you go to the Bible and saying, what do I need for today? My response is, you don’t actually know what you need for today, but God knows what you need. So listen to Him. Find out when a passage… Who’s the author? To whom was it written? Who was a recipient? What’s the historical context? What’s the textual context? I mean, what came before? What came after the verse? What does it say within the entire book in which it’s given? So all of that tells us something about how to understand the Bible. The worst way to understand it is simply grabbing a verse here, a verse there.

Andrew Marcus:

That’s a good word. That’s a good word. And I feel like, I think, correct me if I’m wrong, but maybe there is a shift happening in churches where they’re going more towards expositional.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Maybe I’ve said this in the past, but let me just repeat it. For the first 500 years of the church, all preaching was expositional.

I mean, it’s only when we went towards the Middle Ages, which we also call it Dark Ages, and the time that the church started being a progressive church, adding doctrine upon doctrine, the hierarchy becoming more important, the liturgy being more important than the word, all that kind of stuff started happening, and now you’re no longer preaching scripture. And then when the Reformation happened and we wanted to return to Biblicalism, Sola scriptura, scripture alone is our authority, then at the very same time, all pastors again, were preaching expositionally verse by verse through the books of the Bible.

But now we’ve come to a day when it’s very popular to do lifestyle preaching, topical preaching, all that kind of stuff. And when you do that, you lose a sense of what the Bible has said, and you allow the culture or whatever, that zeitgeist, the word zeitgeist, German word, the spirit of the day, you allow that to dictate what you want to hear. And so you don’t even know it, but you’re not biblical anymore.

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah. And I remember you gave an analogy, I don’t know when this was, but it was just a boat that’s going. And if you’re off one-

Dr. John Neufeld:

Oh, yeah.

Andrew Marcus:

Can you explain that again? Because that just like, it doesn’t look like it’s one degree off.

Dr. John Neufeld:

And a Mariner, especially in the olden days when you didn’t have GPS systems, so if you’re half a degree off, I mean at first it seems like such an insignificant thing, but given enough time, you’ve now drifted so far, you can’t find your way back.

Andrew Marcus:

So we got to just stick to the word and understand the context, understand what it’s saying, who it’s saying it to, and that gives us an understanding for today and how we can apply it. So I’d love to walk through some passages and then we can kind of rabbit trail a little bit too amongst these passages. I think some of them can be very relatable to today and what we’re going through and it can help us navigate it. But one that’s a really big one, and actually my pastor, pastor Brent from our church, he was going through this because he does verse by verse teaching, which I very much appreciate. He doesn’t skip when things get uncomfortable, he just reads it. And this is the word of God.

Dr. John Neufeld:

God bless him.

Andrew Marcus:

I just love that. So Matthew 12:31 and 32, which is the unpardonable or the unforgivable sin.

Now a lot of Christians, and I’ve heard a lot of people who are Christians, they’re worried, “Oh, no, did I do it? Am I not going to be forgiven?” So I’m going to read the passage, I have it right here, and then maybe we can unpack some of your thoughts. This is verse 31 and 32, “And so I tell you, every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven, but blasphemy against the Spirit will not be forgiven. Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven either in this age or in the age to come.” And I’ve had people say, “Oh no, I think I might’ve said something about the Holy Spirit. I think I’m doomed.” Unpack this context and maybe what that specific passage means.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Well, the work of the spirit in Jesus’ ministry is always a work in which He convicts the world of sin, righteousness, judgment. That’s from the Gospel of John. Now, the text that you’re quoting is, “You are not to blaspheme the Holy Spirit.” So the context is that what happened here is there’s a demon oppressed man who’s brought to Jesus, and Jesus of course heals him. And the Pharisees heard this and they said, “Well, it’s only by Beelzebul,” which is a reference to Satan, “it’s only by Satan that he’s casting our demons.” So initially this word is directed specifically at them, and I have some thoughts about this. You’ll remember that in second Timothy, Paul says that he was forgiven because he had acted in ignorance. It’s very interesting that when Jesus is being nailed to the cross and the soldiers who are nailing Him there, Jesus says, “Father, forgive them,” remember, “they know not what they do.”

Andrew Marcus:

“What they do.” Yeah.

Dr. John Neufeld:

You see?

Andrew Marcus:

Interesting.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Those are my thoughts. So Paul says, I didn’t know what I was doing. He means to say, had I known what I was doing, I would’ve been in a very different category entirely.

I think what Jesus is saying to these Pharisees is that they’re acting very much like in the 13th chapter of Matthew where he tells the parable of the wheat and the weeds. So the enemy has come and he has put weeds, which the specific Greek word for weeds is the word darnel. And we know of those specific weeds that in their infancy stage, they look so much like authentic wheat so you can’t tell them apart. But it’s not that they are mistaken about their salvation. They are plants of the evil one, and Jesus calls them the sons of the evil one. So the devil goes out and he plants his evil infiltrators who know exactly what they’re doing, and he puts them in there to disrupt the harvest, to confuse those who are listening, which is the context here. They’re confused about what they’re hearing.

Now, who am I going to believe? I’ve just seen a miracle, but this guy says this, but the guy that says that knows exactly what he’s doing, he has the scriptural knowledge to know what’s going on, but he acts that way because he’s incited by the evil one. He is a plant of the evil one. He has sinned against the Holy Spirit. Light has been shown him and he’s rejected it.

So what is the sin against the Holy Spirit then, and how do you know whether you’ve done it? My response, first of all is that the people who exactly as your pastor had said, if you have this deep inner troubling sense about you and saying, “Oh no, did I do this?” And you’re saying, I don’t want to do this, the person who’s sinning against the Holy Spirit wants to sin against the Holy Spirit.

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah, it’s like a rebellion.

Dr. John Neufeld:

He wants to rebel against the purposes of God. He wants to stop the gospel of Christ from going forward and will do everything he can. And so because the Holy Spirit comes to, what, to convict the world about sin and righteousness and judgment, this person doesn’t want that going on.

So he’s trying to block, and that’s I think, the sin that Jesus is talking about here. And so when it comes to the fact that a person has sinned in a way which they’ve even knowingly sinned, and then they become aware of it and they are overwhelmed with what they’ve done, and they come to the Lord for repentance, that’s not the sin against the Holy Spirit.

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah, ’cause it says any kind and every kind of sin and slander can be forgiven.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Yeah. I mean, I take great courage from when Peter asks Jesus, how many times do I forgive my enemies, up to seven times? And of course, Jesus says 70 times seven. An infinite amount of times is what he really meant. Well, if that’s what we are required to do to those who sin against us, what do you think our Heavenly father does against we who have fallen into the same sin because they’ve been habitual, and we haven’t known how to trust the Holy Spirit or rely upon His power to overcome. We’ve been fighting the sin in our own flesh and we feel overly condemned. And finally we said, God must be tired of me. I keep falling in the same sin. I wonder whether the Holy Spirit’s been convicting me and I’ve been resisting, and therefore I have the sin against the Holy Spirit. That’s how many people think. But that’s not what Jesus is speaking about in that context.

Andrew Marcus:

So I think a lot of people could be rest assured if you’re worried or wondering, you’re probably okay because you care.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Yeah. I mean, we don’t want to be cavalier, right?

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah.

Dr. John Neufeld:

I mean, the reason why we are concerned about our salvation when we overtly sin because we should be. I mean, we are not given permission to sin. We’re followers of Jesus. So if you think that you can willy-nilly sin all the time, well, I don’t know that you’re saved at all, but this sin against the Holy Spirit is talking about specifically the enemies of Jesus. That’s what this is.

Andrew Marcus:

So when it comes to, obviously if someone’s sinning freely, you’d wonder if they are saved to begin with. There’s conviction. I want to talk about judgment, then. I’ll skip ahead to judgment because there is a passage of Scripture in Matthew chapter 7:1, “Do not judge or you too will be judged.” Now, there are other passages of Scripture that say that there should be judgment.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Yeah. Jesus says in John, “Render right judgment.” So he commands you to judge. And in 1 Corinthians chapter five, I mean the Apostle, Paul is dealing with a guy who he’s been sleeping openly with his stepmom And he’s calling upon the church together to make a judgment. And if this guy doesn’t repent, to throw him out. I mean, how do you have excommunication unless you’re making judgments, right?

Andrew Marcus:

So unpack what Matthew seven means, because clearly there are other passages that encourage us to judge.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Correct. They do. So if we’re going to take all of Scripture, then we’re going to say, yes, Jesus must be speaking about a specific kind of judgment here.

Andrew Marcus:

Yes. Because that’s one of the ways that we interpret instead of the verse by verse, you have to take a verse and look at the whole Bible.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Sure. It’s not as if the whole Bible hasn’t been written. We have all of it.

Andrew Marcus:

So we have to see how many times it talks about judgment and then see if our idea lines up with-

Dr. John Neufeld:

Yeah. So if I interpret a text, which puts it at variance with the rest of Scripture, I need to go back and say, I don’t think I’ve understood this. So clearly Jesus is speaking about a kind of judgment. And remember the context here is that here’s somebody who’s… Jesus is using this exaggeration. It’s the way the rabbis used to talk. You’d so exaggerate the situation. So a person, you’re picking out a speck out of somebody’s eye, and you don’t realize that you’ve got a log in your own eye. So you’ve got a Douglas fir sticking out of your eye and you’re looking for a speck, right? So it’s the kind of a judgment that you overlook in yourself, but you call the other person to account for. So let’s be very careful what’s being said here. So most of those kinds of judgments are judgments regarding motivation, and they are the kind of things that I can’t see in you or you can’t see in me. What motivates…

Now if I’m committing adultery, Andrew, and you call me to account for that, it’s something that you can see. I mean, adultery is an observable action and one can make a judgment about it. And we are called upon to do so. That’s what 1 Corinthians five is all about. But in this case, it’s about attitudes that arise. You are just jealous. And so you are not a humble person. You are acting out of pride. There’s 101 ways in which we judge someone because we assume that we know what’s going on in their heart, but only God knows, we don’t. And yet you hear people making those judgments all the time. And so by making attitudinal judgments on someone else, we condemn that attitude in someone and we pass it over in ourselves. I think that’s the issue. Don’t ever judge what you assume to be the motivation for behavior. You can judge the behavior, but not the assumed motivation for it.

Andrew Marcus:

What does it look like to judge Biblically in a Christian setting? Like the example you gave in John?

Dr. John Neufeld:

Yeah. So one of the things is that the apostles or the disciples of Jesus, they’re to understand the teaching of the Pharisees. So the Pharisees are leading people astray because they’re making what they call the oral law are also called the traditions of men. They’re making that of equal weight of scripture. So the disciples are to know the scripture well enough to know the difference between these crazy interpretations and what the actual text is. So they require judgment to know what to do with what they hear. Somebody says, this is true. Somebody says this is true. Make an accurate judgment. So theological judgment we’re supposed to make all the time because there are so many false teachers.

Andrew Marcus:

I was going to say, how do you address false teachers? Like doesn’t Paul name people and call people out and warn people-

Dr. John Neufeld:

He does. He does. I mean every once in a while when I do this, and I’ve heard you do this too, especially let’s say the word, faith teachers, the prosperity gospel guys, I mean, so you make these statements about this is not the true gospel, and indeed it corrupts the gospel, is leading people to Christless eternities, and when you say that, somebody says, “You are not supposed to judge.”

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah, totally.

Dr. John Neufeld:

You hear that all the time because they don’t understand what Christ is actually talking about.

Andrew Marcus:

And then they use this. Matthew seven, “Don’t judge.”

Dr. John Neufeld:

And here’s my response of prosperity gospel guys. I don’t know what motivates them. I mean, God knows what motivates them. What I do know is what they’re teaching will lead you to a Christless eternity, and you need to reject it utterly. So I’m trying to make an accurate judgment and not an inaccurate lawyer.

Andrew Marcus:

So not focus on their attitude or their motives or what they’re thinking, their heart, but they’re teaching that you could hear it, you could see it, you can judge that.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Absolutely.

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah. A couple more passages. Jeremiah 29:11-13 gets misused a lot. “I know the plans I have for you, declares the Lord. Plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future. Then you will call on me and come and pray to me, and I will listen to you. You’ll seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart.” 29:11 is on a bunch of mugs. It’s on a bunch of shirts and great passage, but a lot of people maybe misuse it. Maybe unpack the context of Jeremiah 29:11.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Yeah. Well, the context of all of Jeremiah is Jeremiah is known as the weeping prophet because he’s the prophet who was alive when Israel fell or Jerusalem fell to the Babylonians. The prophets before Jeremiah had been warning because Israel’s sin that God was going to send judgment. I mean, you remember the book of Habakkuk, for instance. I mean, he wants to know why God allows such evil to exist in Jerusalem and seemingly does nothing. And God tells the prophet, “Oh, I am doing something. I’m raising up the Babylonians. They’re that wild impetuous people who care nothing about human life, and I’m calling them to judge you.”

And of course, Habakkuk, he’s overwhelmed and says, “Oh, the worst than we are.” And God says, “Yeah, well, when I’m finished with you, I’m going to deal with them.” But nonetheless, I mean God’s been warning prophet after prophet after prophet, the day of judgment is coming and nobody’s paying attention. Now, along comes Jeremiah and Jeremiah says, you know what? It doesn’t matter with Elijah or Moses or whoever stood before you, my heart would not save these people. The day of judgment is now. So Jeremiah walks around the city of Jerusalem. He’s weeping because judgment is at hand and nothing will deliver them.

They are going to Babylon. Many of them are going to be slaughtered in the streets. This is going to be a Holocaust, and Jeremiah knows it. And in the middle of all of that, God says, and yet I have some long-term plans. So the plans that I have for you are not immediate. You see what I’m saying? That there will come a time when Israel will come back to the promised land and they’re going to rebuild a temple, and the Messiah will come to that temple. I mean, God has some wonderful plans for Israel in the future. So Jeremiah is saying it’s not the end, even though you’re being judged now, there’s good things coming.

So if I’m applying that text, I’m not saying to myself, well, I’m going to claim Jeremiah 29, which means I’m never going to go bankrupt. I’m never going to get sick. I’m never going to have hardship. God is going to plan just good stuff. And my response is, he is planning long-term, good things for me and the plans, the eternal plans that God has, is that I would rule and reign with Christ in perfect joy, having completed a battle against sin, never to sin again, glorifying God in everything that I do, experiencing the pleasure of God and meaningful existence, ruling over God’s creation for all eternity. Those are the plans, and they’re not going to be shut down. So if that’s how you’re handling Jeremiah 29, good on you. Put it on your mug.

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah, that’s awesome ’cause I think we think, oh no, we’re going to misuse it, but there’s a way to understand, and it’s still being so life-giving. It’s like, okay, the plans are good. Not that you’re going to get a Ferrari and a mansion and whatever, but his plan for your life-

Dr. John Neufeld:

I noticed you didn’t mention the Porsche, right, which is what you’re hoping to get.

Andrew Marcus:

The 911 is just, man, I just… So anyone’s an INDOUBT insider, if you want to contribute financially, I would.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Porsche.

Andrew Marcus:

Yeah, white, red interior, I think.

Dr. John Neufeld:

I see. Okay. Yeah but you can’t quote… This is the point.

Andrew Marcus:

My license plate was going to be Jer 2911, and I’d be like. His plans are good, huh? Long term.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Yes. See, there is a misapplying of that, but I think we can look at that and say, look, all of scripture, even though that scripture was given specifically to Israel at the time when the Babylonians were coming, we recognize there is a context for it, but there’s an application that comes to us. And so recognizing the context, we’ll say, what’s the application? The application is, it may be tough right now, but the long-term plans of God will not fail, and all of his promises will be completed in due season. That’s a great promise.

Andrew Marcus:

It’s a great promise. I love that. I can have that on a mug confidently.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Amen.

Andrew Marcus:

Travel mug when I’m in the Porsche. So I just don’t spill my coffee. Red leather. Okay, so John 14:13 and 14. I’ll read it here. “I’ll do whatever you ask in my name. So the Father may be glorified in the Son. You may ask me anything in my name and I will do it.” I’ve heard a lot of the prosperity guys too. We’ll cling onto that and say anything. You can make your bank account.

Dr. John Neufeld:

It says in my name.

Andrew Marcus:

Yes.

Dr. John Neufeld:

So it is done with the authority of Jesus. It is the thing that Jesus would’ve done.

Andrew Marcus:

And so, He would not be asking for a…

Dr. John Neufeld:

A Ferrari. He didn’t even have a place to lay His head, or at least when He said that. I mean, He’s basically saying it because He’s just gone to Samaria and the Samaritans know He was going to Jerusalem. They don’t want anything to do with Jerusalem, so they’re not going to put Him up for the night and they’re just, “Get out of town. We don’t want you.” And so then a disciple comes to Him and says, I’ll follow you wherever you go, because he thinks Jesus is going to Jerusalem to sit on David’s throne and rule over everything and nothing but good stuff’s going to happen. Jesus says, look, I don’t even have a place to lay my head because last night nobody would take me in. So you need to keep that in mind when you follow me, they might not even take you in. So don’t expect this is going to be a life of ease.

So I mean the whole context is this is what Jesus is saying to us. So whenever we call on God in the name of Jesus, we are calling upon Him in the name of the one who speaks for God and who wants the glory of God. And so whenever we ask for something which is fully in line with what Christ desires for the glory of God, we will get that thing.

Now here’s the cool thing. You might say, well, my response is yes at all the promises of God for our long-term eternity is because God will glorify Himself in fulfilling all of His promises that He has made to us. So whenever I claim one of God’s promises rightly, as related to me or to relate it to those around me, I do that with great confidence. I cry out to the Lord. I mean, it may be that in the immediate I am called to suffer, but in the long term, I mean God has promised those future rewards that He has for… They will not be taken from me. So Confidently, I claim them in Jesus’ name And I walk about with the assurance. I mean, I may be walking around in rags, but I won’t be walking around in rags forever. There is a day coming. I claim that.

So don’t take the ask for anything as saying anything means whatever my selfish heart desires so I can spend it on myself and this world and the egotistic pleasures that I have. That’s not what Jesus is all about. You can’t go to God in Jesus’ name asking for things that feed your own pleasure.

Andrew Marcus:

And what about when we ask for things that we think are something that Jesus would do? I’ve heard-

Speaker 3:

What it feeds my wife’s pleasure or my child’s pleasure?

Andrew Marcus:

That’s like you have good intentions of praying for your kids, praying for family, or praying for healing. It’s like a lot of people will take that passage.

Dr. John Neufeld:

And so let’s talk about healing because in healing, we are not promised in scripture that we’re going to be healed of every single disease that we have. We have a promise that we will be eternally healed, that we are given as a sure promise. So what we need to do is we need to claim those promises that we know with certainty.

And then what about those promises that we don’t know with certainty? We know that God is merciful. We know that He’s gracious. We know that He cares for His children. So we come to Him as a child to his father, knowing that the father wants best, and we come and we plead our case before Him as we ought to. And so we confess that God is merciful. And so we plead to Him for mercy, not demanding our rights.

Andrew Marcus:

So confidently ask.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Absolutely.

Andrew Marcus:

And boldly ask.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Absolutely. So you’re going to have a child and Marcus, and let’s say your child is colicky for a number of months and you start asking the Lord, I mean, would you remove it today? And maybe it doesn’t happen today, but that doesn’t mean that God is unconcerned with the immediacy of what you’re going through. Our God cares deeply, and we know that God’s intention for your child, God’s love for your child is greater than you and your wife will ever have. And there is that confidence that we come when we plead on behalf of our child, for instance, that we ask for that. Yeah.

Andrew Marcus:

That’s good. Yeah, I felt like even with my back, I’ve been asking and pleading and then wondering like, Lord, you’re not doing anything.

Dr. John Neufeld:

So the thing that we know about the Psalms is that the Psalms are filled with cries of anguish. “Lord, how long?” So it’s not wrong to say that. “My enemies are triumphing over me,” says David, “how long will the enemy triumph over me? How long will they be allowed to slander me and how long will they allowed to hunt my life?” Well, we might say the same thing of anything that we go through that is really painful to go through. So I would think let the Psalms be our guide. They teach us how to pray. Come to God in anguish and ask those questions.

But did you also notice that the cries of anguish never become cries of anger? You never hear that in the Psalms. No psalmist ever thought, I mean God, you now owe me an explanation because you’ve not taken the anguish away. So we need to recognize that God who is deeply concerned, and we know that God does these things so that we would not have an attachment to this world, but our hope would be an eternity. If this world felt good all the time, we wouldn’t hope in the one to come. But the fact is, this is a sin-cursed world. This is a world that is eventually coming to an end, and we are not to set our affections on this earth, but in the things to come. And the hardships that we encounter are because we are going through them, because God knows He wants to set our affections in the right place. It’s a hard lesson to learn and it’s anguish filled. I mean, it may be that God may allow that back issue. He could snap His fingers and in less than a second it would all be done.

Andrew Marcus:

I know.

Dr. John Neufeld:

He has chosen not to, and it’s not wrong to continue to come before His throne and to continue to plead that He would have mercy in the present hour. And He hears your cry and He will respond to it and give you everything that you need for life and godliness in the present moment. It will give us that ha to know with certainty that our God is watching over us.

Andrew Marcus:

That’s so good.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Yeah.

Andrew Marcus:

That’s a good reminder that He’s trying to help us untether to the world and cling to Him.

Dr. John Neufeld:

C.S. Lewis said it well. He said, there are either heavenly pleasures or there are no pleasures at all for Earth has no pleasure to give. And I think that I’ve always wanted to remember that. Whenever I, why does this earth feel so bitter? Why can this earth, on the one hand be so stunningly beautiful and so overwhelmingly cruel at the same time? How is that possible? I think the answer to them is that God has allowed it to be so that I might hunger and thirst for that which my soul so desperately needs. That is an eternal rest in Him.

Andrew Marcus:

That’s good. Well, Dr. John, thank you so much for being on today’s program.

Dr. John Neufeld:

Thank you for having me, Andrew. Delighted to be here.

Andrew Marcus:

Hey, thanks so much for joining us today. For more great content. Check out The INDOUBT Show on YouTube, Spotify, Apple Music, or wherever you stream your podcasts. We hope you enjoyed it today. Feel free to check out indoubt.ca. We have some great resources available to you. Have an awesome day.

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